I just read a comment or two that got me angry again because of the continuing audacity of dhimmified fools, liars and the ignorant, so I’ve decided to toss the ’smoking gun’ before the jury this morning. I recommend you buy a copy of Inside Islam: A Guide for Catholics by Daniel Ali & Robert Spencer. Starting in question and answer 37 of this book you will stumble into a fact many of you probably are not aware of.
While a great many Westerners are aware by now that Islam does not equate Jesus with Allah or God because Islam absolutely denies the divinity of Jesus Christ, I’m willing to bet that very few realize that there’s much more to the denial in regard to Jesus. The biggest denial in my mind certainly, because it goes across all boundaries secular, Christian, Jewish or otherwise, is the denial by Muslims that Jesus Christ ever died on a cross.
The Qur’an states that Jesus was not crucified.
From Inside Islam:
“Muslims believe that He was taken alive up to Heaven, never having tasted death. It would be wrong for Allah to allow one of His prophets to die in shame and humiliation, so Allah placed someone who looked like Jesus on the Cross. The Jews thought they were actually killing Jesus, but actually the imposter was crucified: ‘they slew Him not nor crucified, but it appeared so unto them’ (Sura 4:157).
The denial of the crucifixion and death of Jesus is, of course, a complete innovation. This denial is in direct contradiction to the Gospel texts. In all four Gospels, Jesus’ passion, death, and resurrection are clearly enunciated. These events are, moreover, attested to in the writings of various non-Christians and secular sources including the writings of the Jewish historian Josephus, the Annals of Tacitus, and others.”
There you have it. The Qur’an, put forth to the world as the “undeniable truth of Allah”, contains at least one outlandish lie that is naked to the eye for any reasoning, educated human being to see for themselves.
So, the next time you are confronted with a Muslim that tries to sway you into swallowing the lies of Islam with more taqiyya and kitman, bring this “little” factoid up and confront them with it. It will work for any atheist, agnostic, Jew, Christian or otherwise non-Muslim.
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Considering that crucifixion was a very common practice of the Romans to display enemies of the state, I think the odds of Jesus not being crucified would be slim to none. Not to mention, to what extent would anyone need to spread disinformation/misinformation in a day when word of mouth by eye-witness was the rule of just about all news? The crucifixion of Christ almost surely happened, but the method is often incorrectly displayed. Crucifixion typically was done with nails through the joints at the wrists and ankles and not through the hands and feet (as most often displayed in art of Jesus on the cross), otherwise the weight of the body would simply be too much and the hands would tear loose.
The Romans crucified THOUSANDS of escaped slaves following the defeat of Spartacus. How Christ might have managed to escape this public display would definitely be one for the record books.
Did you know that none of the apostles or the writers of the bible witnessed the crucifixion of christ? They all abandoned him when he was arrested by Roman soldiers. His crucifixion was even witnessed by at most half a dozen people according to Christian historians. Moreover, according to Christian Scholar J.D. Kelly’s book “Early Christian Doctrine” many early christian sects, who are now extinct, didn’t believe Jesus was crucified. See http://www.jamaat.net/crux/Crux1-5.html
mmm which to believe the earlier religion or the later one (Islam)….difficuly choice….I’ll settle for the one which DOESNT today call for the killing of Jewsand Christians, the killing of Infidels who do not convert..Yep Ill settle for the leasst repressive one thanks.
The good news is that Quran does say , contrary to pupolar mainstreem Muslim view, that Jesus was put to cross with the aim to show that he was a false prophet. The Jews of the time rejected him as the Messiah promised to appear at the time. They callenged him to the effect that the arrival of the Messiah was to be heralded by another expected personality who happened to be John the Pabtist.
Long story short. Jesus is accused, arrested, taken before Piolet, who washes his hands off the blood of this man but hands him back to the crowd. It is Friday, the Jewish Sabath Day. Late afternoon, Jesus is put to cross.
Referring to this event the Quran
“And for their saying, ‘We did slay the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah;’ whereas they slew him not, nor did they bring about his death upon the cross, but he was made to appear to them like one crucified; and those who differ therein are certainly in a state of doubt about it; they have no certain knowledge thereof, but only pursue a conjecture; and they did not arrive at a certainty concerning it. ”
Jesus survives the crucifixion, recovers from a state of swoon while in the “cave” and moves on with his original mission “ I am not sent but unto the sheep of Israel” and travesl to far Eastern region to Kashmir etc., where he dies like all other prophets on this earth.
In this way God demonstrated that Jesus a true prophet and that no one succeeded in killing him to prove he was false. Quran goes in accordance with the historical facts.
There is much debate (uselessly) among the mainstream Muaslim clerics and their circles over this verse, which again is nothing but mystical and conjecture.
Foehammer, Mo,
Points taken and moderation reasons clear. It’s just that I encountered moderation as a first, and wondered, since on another site (Dutch) where I regularly posted suddenly I found very reasonable posts suddenly ‘awaiting moderation’ and subsequentlt deleted. Although the site is also anti-Islam, I never go there anymore.
My phrasing may have been slightly harsh, but I did not mean to bash Christianity. I don’t hate christians, but they should not start interfering with my life. We have a christian party in government in NL now, and they’re trying to stop shops from opening on Sundays, because it’s a religious day. That sort of thing ticks me off. Believe what you want, but don’t bother me with it.
Which of course is the main reason for our joint crusade against Islam. If any ‘religion’ (I don’t consider Islam to be a religion but a political doctrine) wants to interfere with my life, up to the point how I’m supposed to wipe my butt, it’s Islam. And it’s getting worse by the day. Generally, I can work fine with Christians, Hindus, Sikhs, Atheists, whatever. I’ve even worked with an Egyptian Muslim. They’re good at taqqiya, though: in 16 months, he only referred once to Islam conquering the world, but it was enough. As you say, Mo, we’re all infidels to the sand-nazis.
But even religious christians probably agree that thee would not want to be stuck with these “Jesus, He loves me, gimme money” TV evangelists in their afterlife
.
Keep up the good work.
If there is a thread that centers around Christianity it would be appropriate to discuss it. It doesn’t mean anyone or the site is necessarily an evangelical. It seems that atheists are frightened by any mention of religion, what next telling us that we must embrace everything they stand for, or else? Fairly intolerant, you might even call it Islamic intolerance don’t you think?
Thanks SoteriA.
This is must, tackling doctrinal issues no matter what one believes…because Islamic doctrine is pure poison to the free world.
R.Hartman one thing you must understand is the intolerance of Islam over anybody who believes different than them. The most tolerant nations on the face of the earth are the ones established with a strong Christian influence. People who claim Christians are fascist ought to take a little vacation to Saudi Arabia, Iran, Syria…or any other fundamentalist Islamic state.[the argument with Turkey does not work, because there is strong resistance to Islamic domination within the Government & Military] These nations have least freedom for anyone who resists becoming a Muslim. Think of the most holy sites on the planet to Jews or Christians…non believers not only can tour these places, usually are welcomed to. Try to get within miles of the Ka’ba in Mecca…if you are caught you’ll be lucky to see another day.
Islam is the enemy of everybody else
Oh, I agree, Foehammer. I was just tossing it out because people still do argue it.
R. Hartman-
The good thing is that all of us can be united in standing up against the oppression and bullying of Islam. People who normally wouldn’t have much in common, such as Christians and atheists, conservatives and liberals, gays and straights and any other group you can name, can be united in this cause.
For example, I’m a Christian, and I know that Chris Hitchens hates my religion with a passion. But he hates all religions. The fact remains that he speaks out about Islam, and because of that, we can work together. I don’t have to like the guy. I just have to sift out the things he says that are true, and leave the rest.
Let us not get distracted and start hating on each other. This issue is so big that we must put aside the differences we do have and work together. We’re all under the same ‘infidel’ banner!
@Mo: I have to disagree with any appraisal that Jesus may or may not have been crucified. The Romans crucified tens of thousands of people during their reign. The use of Christians for sporting games in the Colosseum and the crucifixion of Jesus are in historical accounts from back in the day. I posted this article based on one assumption — Jesus lived, he was crucified and Islam denies this crucifixion in the Qur’an. This equates to evidence along the same lines as the Satanic Verses that substantiates that Islam is a false cult.
Considering the bloodshed done in the name of Islam over the 1400 years of its existence and the continuing atrocities we witness each and every day, an old and wise saying comes to mind:
“If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck — it’s a duck.”
Islam is a lie. Muslims are trapped within the dogma of this lie. People that value freedom and dignity can not allow themselves to sit back idly and watch it grow in their midst.
Islam must be pushed into the oceans.
One can argue whether this crucifixion actually occurred and the reasons for it, but the fact is that Islam denies this most foundational teaching of Christianity. These two religions have nothing in common, at their very core. You can choose to believe one or the other, but the fact remains that they teach completely opposite things.
I knew this, but I was unaware of that particular book. Another to add to the reading list, thanks!
“Suddenly” I’m moderating the Anvil..?
I suppose some of you might want to see links to Betty Banging Bonnie, etc., but I prefer to catch posts that attempt to upload more than one link at a time as an automatic rule. If anyone wants to see how much the Anvil gets blasted with spam, click on my About or Archives section and look at the statistics. Approaching 30 THOUSAND spam comments since mid-January.
If anyone believes I am capable of controlling all of that manually, then I am a god on Earth and could wash away the taint of Islam myself and would not need to run this site.
There is no “fantasy” about believing in God anymore than there is “fantasy” about not believing in God. Nobody has the Red Phone to the Lord, do they? However, I know I am more than flesh & blood if some of you do not. That is why I am neither Bible thumper nor atheist.
I’m blessed with the ability to look at problems from all sides. This is why I confront Islam so vehemently — I know what it is and I know I don’t want it in my life or that of anyone I care about.
This is also why I can maintain a site like the Anvil and not marginalize any viewpoint. I want people to feel comfortable developing their own opinion of Islam and other threats to the West. Obviously my benevolence does not extend to those that apologize for Islam in the hopes of deluding people, or to those that are obviously Islamists, seditionists or traitors.
Lastly, I do not suffer fools well. Big surprise?
Everyone is moderated equally here that behaves maturely and respectfully. That’s the way it has always been and that’s the way it will always be.
It seems I cannot edit the typo’s out of my last post, and suddenly FH is using moderation. Sure hope you’re not introducing censoring, Foehammer. If it’s related to my ‘flag’, sometimes, when it’s quiet, I post from work, which uses an American proxy. From home, traffic is routed from the Netherlands, where I live.
First sentence of the previous post should have been: “Is FA now turning into an evangelical site?” The other typo’s do not affect readability as much as the missing ’s’ here, so I’ll leave them.
Cheers.
Is FA now turning into an evangelical site? It seems like Islam is creating more and more fanatical christians as well, who feel the urge to uphold their version of the fairy tale.
The only thing the Quran statement means to me is that Allah must be criminal, as instead of having his son killed he just picks a replacement to be killed instead, for opinions he never voiced. It would be willingly invoking a cruel death sentence to an known to be innocent person. Probably an infidel, to keep things in style.
I’m getting very tired of people quoting the Old Testament to prove that the Bible is as bad as the Quran, while the New Testament is supposed to have invalidated the Old Testament. But likewise I get tired of people that need to quote the New Testament to refute the Quran, as they’re both fairy tales. God did not create man, man created God, for man needed an afterlife to allow him to suppress fellow men, make them suffer on earth with the promise of eternal happiness, but you have to die first, and behave as you’re told, or else you’ll end up in hell. Well, if all those religious bigots and up in heaven, it must be hell and I’d sure hopen not to be going there.
Pat Condell did some great video’s on atheïsm, taking on the notion that you would have to be religious to be a decent person. Worthwile.
http://nl.youtube.com/watch?v=oSZYN8UV6yg
http://nl.youtube.com/watch?v=YKcx0biHPR0
http://nl.youtube.com/watch?v=qZO2u-jDNpQ
http://nl.youtube.com/watch?v=atTSwau9fwM